Pressure advance issues

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By heathmanc 31 December 2016 00:01

Member · 26 comments

I have inserted M572 P3 S0.1 into my startup of each print and have not found it to do anything.  I have seen this referenced other places as D0 instead of P3, when changing it to D0, I get some odd banging around noises, but not what I would expect.  This is a single extruder setup on a Duet Wifi with 1.17 firmware.

Charles

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By dc42 31 December 2016 08:52

Administrator · 2,617 comments

You need D0 in the M572 command, not P3. Try reducing the amount of pressure advance to 0.05, or reduce the allowed extruder jerk in the M566 command.


Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
http://www.escher3d.com
https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com

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By Merlin 12 January 2017 13:21

Member · 34 comments

When M572 was introduced in the firmware and published config I removed it, along with a few others, due to print/build issues.
Having read this article i re-introduced it and reduced the retraction amount as suggested.
I simply cannot believe the difference this has made to the quality of my prints; and the faster speeds possible.
Why do we keep this function such a big secret?
=============================
I'm using Matter Hackers slicing software;
an  Ultimate Greg's Wade's Geared Extruder;
and a Volcano type hot end 0.6 mm nozzle.
Firmware 1.17

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By burtoogle 12 January 2017 13:33

Member · 64 comments

Is pressure advance compatible with absolute extrusion mode? Thanks.

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By T3P3Tony 12 January 2017 14:02

Administrator · 760 comments

Hi Merlin, it's not a secret! Just variable requirements  and a wide range of hardware makes it more or less applicable to people.

What printer are you using (Bowden? Length?).


Duet Wifi Hardware Designer
www.duet3d.com
www.think3dprint3d.com

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By dc42 12 January 2017 14:11

Administrator · 2,617 comments
burtoogle wrote

Is pressure advance compatible with absolute extrusion mode? Thanks.

Yes it is. The only feature I am aware of that has issues with absolute extrusion is pause/resume when used with mixing hot ends and mixing is enabled.


Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
http://www.escher3d.com
https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com

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By Merlin 12 January 2017 15:43

Member · 34 comments

Printer is a cross between dc42 "Big Delta" design and T3P3 XL Delta. Duet Wifi.
24V 0.9 deg stepper motors;  all metal construction.
Bowden tube is 53cm ; Extruder motor is 1.8 deg from my old Ormerod 2.

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By tomasf 12 January 2017 15:51

Member · 68 comments
Merlin wrote

Printer is a cross between dc42 "Big Delta" design and T3P3 XL Delta. Duet Wifi.
24V 0.9 deg stepper motors;  all metal construction.
Bowden tube is 53cm ; Extruder motor is 1.8 deg from my old Ormerod 2.

I have a similar machine. How much pressure advance and retraction are you using? Thanks!

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By Merlin 12 January 2017 16:23

Member · 34 comments

M572 D0 S0.1
5mm retraction defined in MatterHacker, not using firmware retraction as MH slicing software does not support it.

[Worth looking at latest version of Matter Hacker - its an interface and a slicer, with great 3D graphics a bit like Simplify3D; it's a free download and has a neat recovery feature, except this feature only works when driving printer from MH via usb]

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By Merlin 20 January 2017 18:16

Member · 34 comments

Further to my earlier posts on this subject:
I see that Matter Hackers slicer does support firmware retraction but cannot hack complex multi colour slicing - very slow, plus limit of 300,000 polygons!
So I have now gone back to S3D - the latest version makes mincemeat  of multi colour slicing and is extremely fast.
Well worth the money as far as I am concerned (but not telling 'her indoors').

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By tomasf 20 January 2017 22:00

Member · 68 comments

I tried 0.1 and 0.15 pressure advance on my delta (600+ mm bowden tube), but I can't see any difference in print quality compared to before. The only difference I notice is that my extruder makes odd sounds while printing the skirt.

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By vonGreezly 6 February 2017 23:34

Member · 11 comments

Does Pressure Advance slow down your printspeed considerably? It's the only variable I've changed, and I seem to have lost the ability to actually control the speed...a 20min test cube turns into a 1.5hr test cube, and adjsuting the speed factor seems to do nothing..

Thoughts?

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By vonGreezly 7 February 2017 01:06

Member · 11 comments

SCRATCH THAT, I was implementing it in the config.g, works in the starting gcode just fine 😄

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By StephenRC 7 February 2017 03:58

Member · 132 comments

I found that I needed to increase the acceleration and jerk values when I started to use pressure advance, otherwise the printing speed was reduced.

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By dc42 7 February 2017 07:52

Administrator · 2,617 comments
StephenRC wrote

I found that I needed to increase the acceleration and jerk values when I started to use pressure advance, otherwise the printing speed was reduced.

The extruder jerk value is the critical one. The extruder acceleration during printing moves is limited to the lower of the value you specified in M201, and the jerk converted to mm/sec and divided by the amount of pressure advance.


Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
http://www.escher3d.com
https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com

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By vonGreezly 7 February 2017 19:20

Member · 11 comments
dc42 wrote
StephenRC wrote

I found that I needed to increase the acceleration and jerk values when I started to use pressure advance, otherwise the printing speed was reduced.

The extruder jerk value is the critical one. The extruder acceleration during printing moves is limited to the lower of the value you specified in M201, and the jerk converted to mm/sec and divided by the amount of pressure advance.

M201 X1000 Y1000 Z15 E1000 ; Accelerations (mm/s^2)
M203 X15000 Y15000 Z300 E3600 ; Maximum speeds (mm/min)
M566 X600 Y600 Z30 E200 ; Maximum jerk speeds mm/minute

Okay, so... If M201 is E1000 and M566 is E200 (mm/m) I'd be limited at the 1000mm/s on acceleration?

If i take 200 / 60 and divide that by .1(pressure advance) I get 33.3mm/s

Am i doing that right? Should I adjust any of that? o.O;

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By dc42 7 February 2017 19:45

Administrator · 2,617 comments

That's all correct. You don't need very high extruder acceleration for printing moves (and pressure advance doesn't affect the acceleration for retract and un-retract moves); however 200mm/min extruder jerk is unusually low, so the associated acceleration limit for printing moves that it causes might have an effect.


Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
http://www.escher3d.com
https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com

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By vonGreezly 7 February 2017 19:53

Member · 11 comments
dc42 wrote

That's all correct. You don't need very high extruder acceleration for printing moves (and pressure advance doesn't affect the acceleration for retract and un-retract moves); however 200mm/min extruder jerk is unusually low, so the associated acceleration limit for printing moves that it causes might have an effect.

Okay! Glad to hear! I believe I even upped that from where it was before... wondering if this might be the cause of my issues haha

What E-Jerk settings would you recommend? Using a e3d Titan with pancake stepper..

Thanks,
  -Casey

I'm experimenting with some pressure issues here too.  Stumbled on this thread, with adding M572 D0 S0.2 (I have an unusually long bowden tube) things seem much better- still tinkering.  What are we actually changing with pressure advance?

Last edited by a96bimmerm3@gmail.com (13 February 2017 14:10)

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By dc42 13 February 2017 20:37

Administrator · 2,617 comments

I've just added wiki page https://duet3d.com/wiki/Pressure_advanc … re_advance.


Duet WiFi hardware designer and firmware engineer
http://www.escher3d.com
https://miscsolutions.wordpress.com

Thanks DC42.  Perfect explanation.